Dr. Anna Yusim wants you to know that we are all capable of finding joy and meaning in our lives. Her approach is multidisciplinary, from infusing classic psychiatry with ancient spiritual practices to employing the latest technologies in neuroscience. When it comes to delivering better mental health in this world, as far as Anna is concerned, the sky is the limit.
Anna is a highly regarded, board-certified psychiatrist and executive coach with a private practice spanning New York City, Connecticut, California, and Florida. Educated at Stanford and Yale, she works with a diverse clientele, including Forbes 500 CEOs, Olympic athletes, and A-list actors, helping them find greater purpose and joy in their lives and careers.
As the best-selling author of Fulfilled: How the Science of Spirituality Can Help You Live a Happier, More Meaningful Life, Anna is also a Clinical Assistant Professor at Yale Medical School, where she is developing a Mental Health & Spirituality Program in collaboration with Yale Divinity School. Additionally, she serves as Chief Medical Officer of Conscious Health, a holistic mental health treatment center in California, and leads initiatives like SuperMind, which employs innovative mental health therapies. A prolific writer and media contributor, Anna has published over 320 works and frequently appears on major news outlets.
In her latest book, Fulfilled, she provides insights into eliminating self-defeating patterns and roadblocks that keep people from living their most authentic life. Packed with fascinating scientific research, case studies from her practice, and an inspiring personal journey, Fulfilled integrates the best of Western medicine with universal spiritual principles.
In the following interview, Anna and I are going to dig into some fascinating and uncomfortable topics in the security field in particular: What happens when you no longer feel connected to a mission? How does one go about integrating their shadow side in a profession that often requires the use of violence? In light of the high divorce rate across the security community, how can we reconnect to our vulnerable side for the sake of regaining intimacy with our spouses?
Learn more about Anna at https://annayusim.com/.
For those who prefer to read a condensed transcript of the interview, text is provided below the following video.
Jessica: In the intro to your book, Fulfilled, you mentioned that your motivation for writing the book was that, despite your impressive career and personal success at the time, you felt something deeper was missing in your life. That inner pain sent you on a journey to explore various modalities of spirituality and then integrate those lessons learned into your psychiatry practice. I also like how you wove these lessons into real-life case studies. Tell me a bit about that journey and how it led to the work you do today.
Anna: Yes, despite my professional and personal achievements, I felt a profound emptiness. I realized something deeper was missing in my life, which prompted me to embark on a spiritual journey to seek fulfillment beyond external validation. I explored various practices, including meditation, mindfulness, and ancient spiritual teachings, allowing me to reconnect with my inner self and understand my emotions more profoundly. This ultimately informed how I connect to my patients as well.
I was born in Russia into a very mathematics and engineering-oriented family. We then moved to America when I was five years old. Growing up, spirituality was the furthest thing from my mind. I started off my studies at Stanford taking math classes, but my passion for the topic quickly dwindled. I wound up switching to pre-med and wound up working with neuroscientist Dr. Robert Sapolsky in his lab studying the effects of stress on the brain. I loved the research and knew then I was committed to studying the brain in some capacity.
While at Stanford, I also discovered the work of existential psychiatrist Dr. Irvin Yalom. He goes deep into human nature and his understanding of people is profound and multifaceted. I wanted to counsel people the way he does and write about it. Since then, I’ve written books, produced documentaries, and am the chief medical officer for Conscious Health, a holistic mental health treatment center in Los Angeles that bridges ancient psychospiritual wisdom with state-of-the-art, evidence-based mental health interventions like ketamine, transcranial magnetic stimulation, and other treatment modalities.
Jessica: Whether it’s the military or an intelligence agency, many security professionals transitioning out of their organizations into civilian work often feel a loss of mission. I know that’s something you talked about early on in your book and I’ve been thinking about this topic because last year veteran Dan Holloway wrote a very insightful piece in Newsweek titled, “It’s Not Trauma That's Fueling Veteran Suicide, It’s Losing Our Sense of Purpose.”
The veteran suicide rate in the U.S. at the time the piece was written in 2023 was approximately 20 deaths per day. There are various factors that contributed to these tragedies, but in regards to the high rates of depression, Holloway argued, “It isn't combat that corrupts men’s souls, but a lack of purpose…We don’t need your pity, we don't even need your sympathy. We need the next mission.” If one of these people walked into your office for treatment, how would you guide that person in finding their next mission in life?
Anna: When individuals come to my office, I take a multi-tiered approach. First, I meet them where they are, understanding their feelings and experiences. Are they depressed, anxious, or feeling spiritually empty? When did these feelings start, and what influences them? It’s essential they know they’re not alone and that we’re here to support them.
If there’s a diagnosis, like PTSD, we explore appropriate treatments. One effective method is EMDR, or Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing. This technique helps individuals process trauma by following a moving point with their eyes, which desensitizes their emotional response to the trauma. Other treatments include EFT (Emotional Freedom Technique), which involves tapping, and various somatic therapies. I collaborate with specialists like Dr. Sheila Salama in Connecticut and New York City to provide comprehensive care.
Many veterans, for example, are physically active and connected to their bodies. Trauma can make them feel condemned and disconnected from their bodies. In this case, the goal is to first give them that breathing space if there's trauma, and then help them reconnect with their feelings and find joy and purpose in their lives.
Many people struggle with a lack of purpose or meaning in life. We work to identify what will help them feel whole again and excited about their next mission—whether that’s raising a family, pursuing a career, or training for a marathon. It’s not about directing someone to their next mission; rather, it’s about providing techniques that help them look inward and find their own path.
Jessica: So, what kind of questions would you ask this person?
Anna: I would ask, what can make your life meaningful again? How do we get you there? How can I support you in taking the steps for yourself to become whole on every level—mind, body and spirit?
Jessica: It’s interesting because asking someone what gives them a sense of purpose can be hard to answer, right? But what gives you a joy is probably easier to answer first for most people and is a great starting point. Commitment to a mission isn’t just about hard work and discipline, but a deep joy in what you’re doing.
Anna: Absolutely. There are so many different flavors of happiness. That includes the joy that comes from overcoming difficult challenges, even if the process is tough. This kind of happiness arises from working toward a greater purpose, giving a sense of fulfillment beyond immediate discomfort. Ideally, you can experience both immediate joy from everyday pleasures and the deeper satisfaction that comes from overcoming challenges for a greater purpose.
Jessica: I love that you brought up the concept of the “shadow side” in the human personality in your book. As a side note, this is a concept studied both in psychology and story craft, since writers need to develop a compelling shadow side in their characters for believable conflict and complexity. The shadow side concept is also pertinent to people who work in the combat zone or fighting crime in the street and are sometimes called upon to use violence to stop violence. As you can imagine, this dynamic can leave some people in the security field feeling conflicted about their identity as the “good guy.” How do you help someone access and integrate their shadow side?
* Author’s Note: To learn more about the shadow side among security professionals, read “When You Stare Into the Abyss” here.
Anna: You raise a crucial point about violence and its connection to the military complex. Often, societies aren’t evolved enough for rational discourse, leading to violence as a default. Many individuals who have engaged in violence experience moral injury. They feel they’ve committed unspeakable acts, often under orders, leaving them with unresolved guilt. This is a whole other form of trauma. It requires different treatment than traditional approaches to PTSD.
Jack Saul, who runs the Survivor of Torture Center at Columbia, emphasizes the importance of community in healing moral injury. Sharing these feelings with others, especially those who weren’t in combat, can lighten the burden. Saul and his wife, psychotherapist Esther Perel, lead powerful presentations that address these unspeakable acts and help veterans process their experiences. This is especially poignant for those who feel betrayed by their government after sacrificing so much. Their work highlights the deep emotional scars left by war and the need for empathy and understanding in healing.
Jessica: I’m so glad you mentioned moral injury—it’s such an important topic, especially after the withdrawal from Afghanistan in 2021. I first encountered the term at the Hero’s Journey mental health symposium in Washington, D.C. last year.
(For those unfamiliar, “moral injury” is the psychological distress a person experiences after participating in or witnessing an event that goes against his moral compass. It’s crucial to discuss because it can lead to depression, anxiety, isolation, and insomnia—issues that often overlap with PTSD.)
Moral injury challenges individuals to confront their shadow side, whether related to their own actions or leadership decisions they disagree with. So I’m glad you brought up that issue of moral injury, because usually when somebody is uncomfortable with their shadow side, it’s because there's something coming up that goes against their morals or their value system.
* Author’s Note: To learn more about moral injury, check out “Battlefield’s Burden: The Impact of Moral Injury in the Military” here and “Forging New Frontlines in Moral Injury on the American Grit Podcast” here.
Anna: Moral injury is a crucial consequence often overlooked when discussing acts of violence, like killing innocent civilians. Violence, unfortunately, tends to be the medium of exchange in the military complex.
While a strong military is necessary for national security, we must seek better, more humane approaches to resolving conflicts. Unfortunately, reason, rationality, and compromise often fall short in the face of global challenges and individuals involved are left to deal with the psychological consequences.
Jessica: I think that’s kind of the irony of being part of the defense establishment, especially people who are involved more directly in the field. The work you’re doing is holy work, but at the same time, it burns the soul. So, you have to figure out how to deal with that, right?
People need to know they’re not alone, that actually to have these uncomfortable experiences or the shadow side is actually normal. Once things are brought out into light, you realize you’re not really abnormal; you’re just responding to abnormal situations. I think that takes so much pressure off people.
Anna: That’s exactly it. Many young soldiers find deep meaning in their military missions, experiencing strong camaraderie and purpose. But when they return home, the question becomes: how do they make sense of their experiences, especially the moral complexities and shifts in their bodies and minds? How do you make meaning of the fact that your body and nervous system is responding in a different way now? How do you make meaning of this emptiness that you feel now that your closest colleagues, your companions, are gone and the mission is over?
Reintegrating soldiers into civilian life is crucial and requires a nuanced approach to address the feelings of emptiness and the loss of connection to their former mission and companions.
Jessica: A lot of people who grapple with moral injury don’t necessarily grapple with it in the battlefield, where values can become ambiguous in the chaos of war. They grapple with it when they come back to the civilian world.
Anna: Yes, the contrast can be disturbing, but figuring it out and dealing with it can also create a more integrated person. And individuals have to be given the space to really talk about how they’re feeling and what they’re going through. And hopefully do that in a group who are also reintegrating to realize that you are not alone.
Jessica: It’s interesting, something you brought up earlier about how people in the security field tend to be very physical. I’m also thinking about that in the context of intimacy, of marriages and even other relationships in somebody’s life.
It’s no secret in the security field, especially among veterans and police officers, that there’s a high divorce rate. One contributing factor to this phenomenon is a difficulty that these people face with emotional connection in their personal lives, including the vulnerability that comes with intimacy. Why do you think this is the case? And what can a person struggling with this issue in their relationship do about it?
Anna: Reintegrating into society can be stressful, especially when reconnecting with loved ones. Many spouses experience this stress, and it’s truly heartbreaking—for both the individual with trauma and their loved ones. Extensive research has highlighted the impact of military service on spouses. It’s crucial to equip them with tools to better understand their partner’s behavior, recognizing that their responses are often normal given their experiences. This understanding can help spouses manage the situation more effectively.
For those with PTSD—often without full awareness of their condition—intimate connections can trigger overwhelming emotional responses. Something very normal that is an emotional response to intimacy could actually be something incredibly overwhelming. And they’re like, I don’t know what’s happening. Why is this happening? And so I think that that’s a very real response, and it’s our autonomic nervous system and our bodies and our minds confusing misinterpreting the strong emotion of love as a trauma-related fear.
Hypervigilance, a common PTSD symptom, exemplifies this misalignment, where emotional or physical responses feel disproportionate to the situation. Hypervigilance being an emotional response or a physical response that’s out of proportion with what is happening. To help people better interpret these emotions and process these emotions, there are various techniques like somatic therapies, EMDR, and EFT.
Jessica: How can someone use mindfulness and spirituality to heal from psychological trauma?
Anna: When it comes to using spirituality to heal from trauma, there are so many different ways. For healing from trauma through spirituality, I deeply admire the work of Dr. Erin Fall Haskell. She integrates various spiritual principles, guiding individuals to reflect on how these concepts relate to their lives. A key insight she shares is that the pain we experience often serves a purpose, as our souls may call in these challenges for growth. By understanding that this journey is about learning and transformation, we can navigate hardship with the knowledge that it will eventually pass, allowing us to move forward in life.
Dr. Haskell draws from multiple spiritual traditions, emphasizing that these principles often overlap across different religions. She believes in the “science of energy,” which relates closely to concepts found in Kabbalah and new-age spirituality. Personal growth, she suggests, often comes from going against our natural tendencies. For example, if someone tends to shut down in relationships when overwhelmed, the challenge lies in expressing their feelings instead.
Conversely, if someone reacts with anger, they might benefit from introspection and composure.
Ultimately, we face a choice between a life of comfort, marked by complacency, and a life of growth, which requires embracing discomfort. Committing to this journey means recognizing where we are, understanding our desire for change, and actively choosing the path that leads to transformation.
Jessica: Ok, so no pain, no gain. It’s like going to the gym and pushing hard on those muscles if you want to get stronger, right?
You mentioned before that to truly embrace self-awareness and improvement, it’s essential to understand yourself deeply, including acknowledging your shadow side and weaknesses. Instead of avoiding the flaws, confront them deliberately as opportunities for growth and soul correction. Tell me a bit more about how your own journey has been impacted by studying these concepts against the context of Buddhism and Kabbalah.
Anna: Kabbalah and Buddhism have both played significant roles in my spiritual journey, yet they present opposing philosophies. Kabbalah emphasizes the importance of desire, teaching that identifying and pursuing our desires is key to growth. This involves principles like going against one’s nature and practicing restriction to achieve what we want.
In contrast, Buddhism focuses on relinquishing desire and attachments, encouraging a life fully lived without clinging to specific outcomes. It teaches that suffering stems from these attachments, and by cultivating a healthier relationship with them, we can reduce our suffering significantly.
Much of our suffering stems from attachments to the stories we tell ourselves. By examining these narratives, we can identify the sources of our pain and consider alternative, less destructive interpretations. Reflecting on the origins of these stories allows us to question their validity and imagine what life would be like without them, ultimately recognizing the observer within us who shapes our consciousness and experiences.
Jessica: While objective truth exists, it can be viewed from many angles. In your book’s case studies, I noticed that people often shared their stories from a specific perspective. Your responses encouraged them to explore different viewpoints, and those who embraced this shift found it transformative, helping them move toward greater meaning and joy.
Anna: At the end of the day, we’re all storytellers and neurotologists. We need to examine our stories and determine which ones serve us and which do not. For those narratives that hinder our growth, it’s important to upgrade them to more constructive and evolved perspectives.
Expanding our viewpoint can lead to significant transformation. Sometimes it’s a matter of reframing an experience and examining it in a different light that helps us appreciate the growth process.
Jessica: There are many applications to what you’re saying about storytelling. People often assign labels to themselves within these stories, and it’s crucial not to label oneself as a victim, even in cases of legitimate victimization, as you pointed out. Your focus on empowering patients through their narratives emphasizes the importance of using labels that uplift and encourage growth.
Anna: Exactly. While many people experience legitimate victimization and trauma, it’s crucial to differentiate between being victimized and adopting a victim mentality. The victim mentality is undermining; it fosters a sense of righteous indignation where one constantly blames external forces for their circumstances. To escape this mindset, it’s essential to take full responsibility for your life and release any feelings of victimhood, ultimately removing the hooks that keep you tethered to that identity.
Jessica: As Viktor Frankl would say, it’s not about what happens to you; it’s about how you decide to react. So, closing up shop here, for the people out there who are struggling with their mental health in silence and are afraid to seek treatment, what is your message to them?
Anna: You’re not alone. Please seek treatment and do so immediately. There is a wealth of support available for security professionals who have suffered from trauma, so please seek the help you need to feel healthy and whole again. Beyond the pain and suffering lies a profound purpose, not just for yourself but for others who need your strength and experience. By overcoming your challenges, you can inspire and guide others on their own journeys to healing.
I wish everybody who’s tuning in here all the best in overcoming whatever it is that you need to overcome, because all of us are overcoming something.
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About Jessica Lauren Walton: Jessica is a communications strategist, video producer, and writer in the U.S. defense sector. She has written articles on a range of security and mental health topics and conducted interviews with military leadership, CIA officers, law enforcement, psychologists, filmmakers, and more. Jessica recently completed her memoir about her experience as an American woman struggling with mental illness while trying to get into Israeli intelligence.
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